Magic: The Gathering @ Guelph

Hey guys. I have been out to a couple tournaments over the past few weeks (Zendikar draft / Intro deck wars) and am starting to get a feel for what its like to play paper Magic again (after a 10 year hiatus). I have been an online player for a couple years now and have invested a bit into the digital cards I am finding it difficult to justify buying the cards (again) for paper. Thus the question:

How do people feel about players using proxy cards?

Now, before the flaming commences, let me first outline some conditions:

1) Obviously I would never use proxies in any type of DCI sanctioned tournament (or any tournament for that matter).

2) My proxies are very high quality (colour laser printed on card stock). Even a couple of the people I played on one of the weekends and last Thursday didn't know they were proxies when they are in the sleeves.

My goals in of using proxies are two-fold:

1) I enjoy playing actual people and for those looking to prepare for an actual tournament, I can provide a means to practice against specific archetypes. Also, the practice for myself in playing skilled players would be very beneficial.

2) I am not sure what type of deck I would like to play yet anyway and thus, if I were to invest in real cards again, I don't want to waste money on a deck that I won't like.

Basically, the only paper cards I actually own are from 4ed through to Ice Age and a small amount off other random sets. I don't think I can afford to invest a lot in making competative constructed decks at this point but the limited format tournaments will suit me just fine.

So what are your thought? Do you scorn those that use proxies? Do you care?

As long as it's not in a DCI sanctioned tournament, I have absolutely no problem with proxies.

I would probably have issues playing a proxied balance/zuran orb deck, but then again, I would probably have issues with playing a non-proxied balance/zuran orb deck.

By all means bring some proxies. Magic is about having fun afterall.

The only issue I would have is with DCI sanctioned tournaments, otherwise go nuts. I wouldn't mind seeing your printing program if they are that nice....

On a side note, is the legacy (or vintage) event planned to be DCI sanctioned? Or will it be 5 proxy, etc?

I don't think the Legacy event is proxy, no. But I am unsure, so ask Eddie.

at 03:57PM on Oct 26, 2009

The only issue I would have is with DCI sanctioned tournaments, otherwise go nuts. I wouldn't mind seeing your printing program if they are that nice....

On a side note, is the legacy (or vintage) event planned to be DCI sanctioned? Or will it be 5 proxy, etc?

I am actually a software developer by trade so I created a .net windows program to create my proxy cards/decks for me.  It takes in a text file (or a "deck" file)  and produces a pdf with all the cards in the deck. 

I basically have every card from every set ever made in the program (actually it was another program that got all the card info and images from the net) so pretty much anything is possible. 

If you make a program that cool proxy all you want.  It is good to play with cards before building something.  I haven't made an effort to trade or collect any specific decks yet either, as I like to test on MWS before going in on an idea.   Don't think Legacy was a proxy event, but maybe it should be at the dragon because of the influx of newer players.  We'll bring it up with the overlord, Eddy... 

What program? I've been using the one from slightlymagic, it's run from the command line and using a standard .csv file and it works fine.

You should ask around, my cube's using both good and bad proxies, the bad proxies are for encouragement for me to go and get the cards.

I don't think anyone at the Dragon will care about proxy at casual games, but at any of our events that has a prize and entry fees (unless stated so), proxies will not be allowed.

Legacy isn't proxied as of yet, we'll decide, but probably not.

at 11:56AM on Oct 27, 2009

What program? I've been using the one from slightlymagic, it's run from the command line and using a standard .csv file and it works fine.

You should ask around, my cube's using both good and bad proxies, the bad proxies are for encouragement for me to go and get the cards.

I don't think anyone at the Dragon will care about proxy at casual games, but at any of our events that has a prize and entry fees (unless stated so), proxies will not be allowed.

Legacy isn't proxied as of yet, we'll decide, but probably not.

What program do I use?  The one I created ;)

If you have a (non-Mac) laptop with the .net framework installed at the store sometime when I am there, I can show you (its on my usb key).  It also allows you to test decks via a solitaire like interface.

What can I say, I was bored . . .

Nice, and nahhh, I own a mac, I do prefer the Unix based system. but I emulate a windows so I can MWS online ;)

I didn't realize that you guys actually use proxies for certains (casual) formats.  The proxies I brought in yesterday seem to be well received.  I actually printed them out myself and then got them cut at a print shop but it was a bit of a hassle (but it saved me some money).  In the future, though, I would probably get the print shop to do both the printing and cutting.

If anyone is interested in aquiring some proxies, let me know, and we can work something out.

So yah Bergsma, if I give you a 20 sometime, and a list, can you get me a nice cut stack of cards? it'll be much better for the cube if i can get some of them printed better

Cool.  Email me the list and we can go from there (bergsma@gmail.com).

Hey again,

A bunch of people have been asking about getting some proxies made and how much it would cost to do so.  Unfortunately its hard for me to answer right on the spot as there are a lot of variables that go into the production of high quality proxies (rounded corners? double-sided? with sleeves? etc). 

Typically the bigger the order, the cheaper (per deck) it will be to produce.  Keep in mind that I am really not looking to do this as a source of income; there really isn't a large profit margin to be had in the magic card proxy business.  Moreover, I am pretty sure its "techincally" infringing on some kind of copywrite laws (but we'll just keep that between you and me).  Basically, I am charging for the cost of the materials (toner, paper) and the time it takes for me to either cut/round the cards myself (small number of cards) or outsource the cutting to an actual print house (for larger quantity).  In any case, I am happy to do this as a service for the group.

As a standard, I will say that a single deck (60 cards + 15 card sideboard) will cost $25.  That will be the best quality proxy with rounded corners, double-sided, and include sleeves.  Basically, it will be ready to play the second I hand it to you.  The cost can obviously be reduced by not wanting rounded corners/double-sided/sleeves but that will have to be calculated per order.

As I said earlier, a larger quantity can be done for for a cheaper per/deck price.  If you wanted to run a guantlet of 8 deck decks, for example, I could produce them for around $120 (again, the high quality ones with sleeves).  That saves almost $5 a deck. 

Last thing;  while the quality of the cards is high, it is not perfect, and in no way should they be considered for use in any sort of official tournament or trading.  One look at the cards, at the right angle, and its plainly visible that the cards are proxies.  Consider yourself warned.

I think that's it for now.  If you have any questions or want to get some proxies made up, let me know.  My turnaround is usually a few days but can rush something if need be. 

Later,

Bergs

(bergsma@gmail.com)

One more thing, I actually created another email address to try and keep things a bit more organized, so you can either use the one above, or this one (preferred):

magicproxies@gmail.com